MINUTES OF THE JOINT SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING OF SENATE COMMITTEE ON FINANCE AND ASSEMBLY COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS Sixty-eighth Session March 7, 1995 The joint subcommittee meeting on Human Resources/K-12 of the Senate Committee on Finance and the Assembly Committee on Ways and Means was called to order by Chairman Raymond D. Rawson, at 7:45 a.m., on Tuesday, March 7, 1995, in Room 352 of the Legislative Building, Carson City, Nevada. Exhibit A is the Agenda. Exhibit B is the Attendance Roster. SENATE COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Senator Raymond D. Rawson, Chairman Senator William J. Raggio Senator Bob Coffin Senator Dean A. Rhoads ASSEMBLY COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Mr. Lynn Hettrick, Chairman Mrs. Jan Evans, Chairman Ms. Sandra Tiffany Mr. Dennis L. Allard Mrs. Vonne Chowning Mr. Joseph E. Dini, Jr. STAFF MEMBERS PRESENT: Bob Guernsey, Principal Deputy Fiscal Analyst Mark Stevens, Fiscal Analyst Larry L. Peri, Program Analyst Cristin Buchanan, Committee Secretary OTHERS PRESENT: John Sarb, Administrator, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources Thom Reilly, Deputy Administrator, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources Pamela Case, Chief, Division of Systems and Programming, Department of Information Services Sherry Blackwell, Budget Analyst, Department of Administration David R. Gamble, District Court Judge, Ninth Judicial District Steven Thaler, Director, China Spring Youth Camp Christa Peterson, Deputy Administrator, Treatment Services, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources Robert A. Cavakis, Director, Youth Correctional Services, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources Annette Swainston, Administrative Services Officer III, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources Charlotte Crawford, Acting Director, Department of Human Resources Sheila Leslie, Lobbyist, Action for Nevada's Children Wendie Catron, Committee Health Nurse, Washoe County District Health Department May S. Shelton, Lobbyist, Washoe County Deann Blazzard, Lobbyist, Foster Parents of Southern Nevada Howard Thomas, President, Nevada Volunteers of Nevada Nancy Peterson, School of Social Work, University of Nevada, Reno Senator Rawson petitioned John Sarb, Administrator, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources, to open the hearing. Mr. Sarb provided a brief overview of programs contained in the department. During his testimony, Mr. Sarb stated the Governor has requested the department to pull the General Fund appropriation for a juvenile boot camp due to the possibility of federal funding. Mrs. Evans asked for an explanation of the Governor's request to pull the boot camp consideration, commenting, "...When you say you are pulling it, you are not pulling the proposal for a juvenile boot camp. That is still on the table. You are just saying, in terms of state dollars?" Mr. Sarb answered in the affirmative. Children and Family Administration - Page 1273 Mr. Sarb began his testimony on the budget and provided a brief description of the division. Senator Rawson queried, "There was a recommendation that new offices be opened in Battle Mountain and Pahrump, and that is not in the Executive Budget?" Mr. Sarb responded: That is correct. If we look at our underserved areas, high up on that list would be...Battle Mountain and Pahrump...We are spending the equivalent of...two full- time positions serving Battle Mountain...We are serving it out of Elko, which is a 50 minute to 1 hour drive. Even if we wind up sending somebody from Elko every day to Battle Mountain, it is effectively only a 3/4 time position because they are driving for 2 hours...I have been out to Battle Mountain to talk to those people...I have a community out there that wants, and I think deserves, better coverage than they are getting. Senator Raggio asked why two temporary superintendent positions for the Northern and Southern Nevada Children's Home are now being reclassified. Mr. Sarb indicated he is not aware those positions are temporary. Senator Rawson clarified during the 1993 legislative session, the positions were made temporary pending further review in the 1995 session. He stated: My understanding...is we had two faithful state workers...we wanted to give the state an opportunity to...protect those positions, but we put it in the budget the way that we did so that it could be reviewed in this session...Those were very temporary positions. Mr. Sarb commented one of the two employees no longer works for the state and the other employee is currently being trained as a hearing officer for the division. Senator Rawson requested the Fiscal Analysis Division to review the budget concerning the two positions in question. He turned his attention to the Statewide Automated Child Welfare Information System (SACWIS) program and questioned if the division will put out a request for proposal (RFP). Mr. Sarb confirmed that when phases two and three of SACWIS are implemented, a RFP will be issued. Senator Rawson questioned if an outside consultant is being utilized for phase one, which constitutes a business process reengineering (BPR). Mr. Sarb reflected KPMG Peat Marwick is performing the BPR. He stated the Department of Information Services (DIS) will put out the RFP for the second phase, once the BPR has been completed. Mr. Hettrick commented he is concerned about cost overruns on comprehensive case management control systems. He stated the need for tight sanctioning against contractors and suppliers of programs if they do not perform within the terms of the contract. Mr. Hettrick turned his attention to the increase in the budget and stated the subcommittee will require justification for such a large increase. Mr. Sarb stated a majority of the increase is derived from transfers from other divisions. Thom Reilly, Deputy Administrator, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources, interjected that Nevada's ratio of caseworkers to clients is higher than the national standard. He indicated that some positions being transferred into the division are a result of federal funds used to expand the Family Preservation and Childrens Resource Bureau to rural Nevada. He stated the social workers requested are based on a maintenance increase of 3 percent, which will bring the case ratio down to 1 to 35, from the current ratio of 1 to 44. Additionally, Mr. Reilly indicated the ratios for child protective services are lower, 1 to 16, inasmuch as child abuse cases are investigated. Mr. Hettrick inquired whether the contract with the company performing the BPR contains adequate sanctions. Mr. Sarb answered in the affirmative and informed the committee the company performing the BPR will not be paid until the project has been completed. Ms. Tiffany remarked: I am a little bit bothered by your discussion on the contract...It is not okay just to not pay them until they deliver. That is not the point...I would like to make sure that that contract not only has performance bonds and liquidation damages, I would like to see something implemented in that for a firm delivery date, and not just sanctions on not paying them. Senator Rawson assigned Ms. Tiffany to chair a subcommittee to address the issue of sanctions for contracts in which terms are not met. Senator Rawson cautioned Mr. Sarb if the terms of any contracts outstanding are not met, the Legislature may "scrap" the project. Ms. Tiffany inquired as to the proposed completion dates for phases I and II of the SACWIS program. Mr. Sarb responded phase I will be complete in May, 1995. Pamela Case, Chief, Division of Systems and Programing, Department of Information Services, interjected that no scheduled completion date has been set for phase II. Senator Rawson requested Ms. Tiffany to work with the division in developing a cost benefit analysis for the SACWIS project. Mrs. Evans questioned what efforts are being made to ensure the success of the sexual offender program. Mr. Reilly explained the division requested one full-time employee, for the Las Vegas office, to perform sex offender evaluations; however, the Governor funded a half-time position. The northern Nevada office contracts out for the evaluations, he explained. Mrs. Evans asked if the budget reflects changes in the division's rent for the Fallon and Winnemucca offices. Sherry Blackwell, Budget Analyst, Budget Division, Department of Administration answered in the negative. Mrs. Evans inquired if the budget division will submit an amendment to the budget regarding those changes. Ms. Blackwell indicated she is not aware of any increase in rent or space for the Fallon and Winnemucca offices. Mr. Sarb informed the committee he will meet with the budget office to review the additional rent costs and will provide the information to the committee by the end of the day. Youth Alternative Placement - Page 1331 Senator Rawson called on David R. Gamble, District Court Judge, Ninth Judicial District, to open the hearing on the budget. Judge Gamble testified as to the needs of the China Spring Youth Camp and furnished the committee with a handout titled China Spring Youth Camp, Douglas County, (Exhibit C). Senator Rawson questioned whether the proposed increase in funding for the China Spring Youth Camp is for the development of new programs or whether it is meant to counter the crowded capacity of the camp. Judge Gamble indicated the increased funding will be used for buildings and grounds maintenance and for increased utility expenses from the additional vocational building. Senator Rawson questioned whether the school district is involved in the camp. Steven Thaler, Director, China Spring Youth Camp, reported the Douglas County School District provides three full-time teachers for the camp. He clarified the school district does not participate in the vocational aspect of the program. Senator Raggio inquired if there are any boys from Elko in the program. Mr. Thaler confirmed that there are currently four boys from Elko at the camp. Senator Rawson asked if the camp is running the Checker Program and Mr. Thaler answered in the affirmative. Mrs. Chowning asked why there is a large difference in the funding of the Spring Mountain Youth Camp in Clark County and the China Spring Youth Camp in Douglas County. Senator Rawson requested the Fiscal Analysis Division to meet with Mrs. Chowning to answer any questions she may have regarding the funding of the two programs. Senator Raggio questioned the feasibility of expanding the China Spring Youth Camp. Mr. Thaler stated an expansion will be cost prohibitive. Judge Gamble intervened that an expansion of the China Spring Youth Camp will have a negative effect on the program, reducing the amount of one-on-one time between the juvenile and teacher. He reflected: ...One of the real strong points of this...was that we decided to all call it regional treatment. There were lots of reasons for that, among them being that you could more closely regulate reintegration of boys back into the community because they are in the community...It is less effective the further out you get. The further out you go, the less ability you have to reintegrate boys and to prepare them to go back into the community. We would very strongly encourage funding of other regional treatment facilities around the state.... Youth Community Services - Page 1287 Mr. Sarb began testimony on the budget and provided the committee with an overview of the proposed format changes requested by the division. Senator Rawson denoted the Fiscal Analysis staff has fundamental disagreements with the division on how to establish the base budget. He indicated the division will need to meet with the Fiscal Analysis Division and the Budget Division to properly display the base budget. Senator Rawson turned his attention to the large amount of out-of-state placements and asked Mr. Sarb if the division has considered using a committee to review each out-of-state placement. Mr. Sarb affirmed the division uses such a committee. He indicated the factors influencing out-of-state placements are the lack of adequate facilities to accommodate the profoundly affected children and an increased dependency on privatization. Mr. Sarb outlined his strategy to prevent further out-of-state placements as being threefold: ...One, the in-state state run treatment homes...are currently operating under capacity...we need to staff them up. They are...appropriate placements for a lot of the kids we have out-of-state. Two, clinical case management...We have...the residential capacity in-state, but we do not have people with the clinical skills to case manage these cases. The model we have used has been successfully used in a number of other states...essentially...they have the full range of services up to and including acute psychiatric. What we would do is bring them back in-state and bring those services to them through clinical case management...Third...is a Capital Improvement Project (CIP) that will be considered for a juvenile treatment facility in southern Nevada...I think with those three things in place, we will have the capacity...to be able to treat those children in-state. Mr. Hettrick asked how many out-of-state children the division will be bringing back to Nevada. Christa Peterson, Deputy Administrator, Treatment Services, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources, stated the division hopes to return 24 children in fiscal year (FY) 1996 and 28 children in FY 1997. Mr. Hettrick questioned, if by bringing back the more severely affected children, will the average length of stay increase, thereby raising the cost of treatment. Ms. Peterson implied that the longer length of stay for out-of- state children is not merely due to the behavior of the children. She stated a portion of the out-of-state children are sent due to the unavailability of beds within the state. She added that with clinical case management to provide intensive support to a child in state placement, the average length of stay should remain the same. Mr. Hettrick requested clarification of Ms. Peterson's remark and asked, "Don't we have some empty beds available now, and you just told me we are sending them out because we don't have available space?" Ms. Peterson confirmed the division is under capacity at the on- campus treatment home beds at Northern Nevada Child and Adolescent Services and Southern Nevada Child and Adolescent Services. Reiterating his question, Mr. Hettrick asked, "Do we have a shortage or a surplus?" Ms. Peterson affirmed the division currently has a shortage of beds. Mr. Hettrick expounded his concern that bringing the out-of-state children back in-state will not save money. Mr. Sarb surmised that Mr. Hettrick's concern is the $19.8 million budget for Title XIX (Medicaid). Mr. Sarb explained close to $4 million of the $19.8 million budgeted is for the primary health care of the 3,500 children in the division. He indicated the remaining portion of the funds for the Title XIX line item is for in-state and out-of-state residential care. Mr. Sarb clarified: ...For example, the Welfare Division's...final estimate for how much that category [Title XIX] would cost in 1996 was $18.7 million...Our budget figure...is $16.4 million, so that is $2.3 million less than Welfare's estimate. That is the reduction that was taken for the treatment homes, staffing them up. I'm not sure that interchange was clear, we have the beds, but they are not staffed up. So that money is for the treatment homes and what we figure we can save in the clinical case management. Mr. Hettrick conceded it will be more cost effective to staff the in state facilities and bring some children currently located out- of-state back to Nevada's facilities. Mr. Hettrick proclaimed his concerns over the sharp rise in the budget and stated: ...We have $16 million budgeted in the first year, $17 million in the second, if we double those based on the growth we have seen in the last biennium, this thing is totally out of control. I don't know how we are going to pay for this...if we perform at the same rate that we have been performing...we are in a world of hurt. That is what this committee is concerned with...if we continue on the same basis of what we are doing right now, we have real problems. Mr. Sarb replied the division recognizes the budget for the upcoming biennium will not be the same as the budget in the current biennium, and stated, "The advantage of using that is that we are spending that money right at 50 percent of General Fund rather than 100 percent General Fund." Mr. Sarb informed the committee the division can, if carefully planned, use only the funds recommended by the Governor. Senator Rawson interceded his interpretation of the concerns expressed by Mr. Hettrick is the committee does not believe the division can successfully operate at the figure stated. Senator Rawson indicated the need for careful management on this budget. Mrs. Evans brought Mr. Sarb's attention to Exhibit D and stated, "...A dramatic illustration of our concern that out-of-state placements...seem to be out of control....". Mrs. Evans requested Mr. Sarb to work closely with Charlotte Crawford, Acting Director, Department of Human Resources, to review the management of the division. Additionally, Mrs. Evans requested that a separate line item for out-of-state placement expenses be placed in the budget. Senator Coffin asked if the division can provide specific personal information on the children currently in the program Senator Rawson cautioned the division to comply with any privacy guidelines when releasing information about the children. Mrs. Evans questioned if the division is anticipating a small growth in subsidized adoptions. Mr. Reilly revealed the division is expecting a 5 percent increase in subsidized adoptions in FY 1997. Victims of Domestic Violence - Page 1295 Mr. Sarb indicated the program agrees with the Governor's Recommended amounts as listed in the budget. Senator Raggio requested a breakdown of where funds collected from marriage license fees are used. Child Abuse and Neglect - Page 1297 Senator Rawson asked if federal funds could be utilized to fund the full-time Nurse Case Manager/Medically Fragile position. Mr. Sarb indicated the division is currently soliciting federal funding for the position. Child Welfare Trust - Page 1301 Senator Rawson petitioned Mr. Sarb to begin testimony on the budget. Mr. Sarb stated the Child Welfare Trust budget houses an account for court-ordered child support payments, which are transferred to support the Youth Community Services cost of care. Children's Trust Account - Page 1303 Senator Raggio requested information on expenditures from the Children's Trust Account budget. Northern Nevada Child & Adolescent Services - Page 1305 Mr. Sarb indicated the program contains the treatment homes discussed in the Youth Community Services budget which will be used to bring children, currently located out-of-state, back to the state for treatment once facilities are fully staffed. Referencing the Enhancement 275 Consumer Treatment (E-275) decision unit, Mr. Hettrick stated: We notice in...decision unit E-275...there is a request for psychiatric services backup and it is our understanding that we do that with existing adult psychiatric care people in the south...We are wondering why we can not do the same thing in the North. Ms. Peterson indicated the southern facility has an arrangement with the southern Nevada adult facility psychiatrists to provide on-call coverage for the child facility and the Southern Nevada Child and Adolescent Services psychiatrists provide the same on- call coverage for the adult facility. She stated a similar arrangement could be negotiated for the northern facility; however, she emphasized the Nevada Mental Health Institute and the Northern Nevada Child and Adolescent Services currently have staff shortages, which will make it difficult to obtain adequately trained and qualified staff to provide the necessary cross coverage between adult and child populations. Mr. Hettrick asked what psychiatric services the northern facility currently utilize. Ms. Peterson stated the facility has a small contract with a private psychiatrist to provide backup coverage. The facility currently has one psychiatrist on call 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Mr. Hettrick requested a copy of the contract with the private psychiatrist. He asked if it will be more cost effective to increase the contract with the current psychiatrist or to contract with additional psychiatrists. He commented, "I would be interested to know how many times the on staff psychiatrist had to come back in and how many hours he actually lost. I would like to see that as well and see what we really have to cover here." Ms. Peterson relayed she will provide Mr. Hettrick with the requested information. Southern Nevada Child & Adolescent Services - Page 1313 Mrs. Evans questioned if the program is losing federal funds for Project Crisis. Mr. Sarb answered in the affirmative. Ms. Peterson expounded that funding for Project Crisis has been made through discretionary federal grants since 1989, but will no longer be available as of October 1, 1996. She indicated the department is requesting General Fund appropriation to fund Project Crisis through the budgets of the Northern Nevada Child & Adolescent Services and Southern Nevada Child & Adolescent Services. Mrs. Evans asked what the department is planning for the Project Crisis program. Ms. Peterson stated the department is exploring the possible use of other federal funding to offset costs. Mr. Hettrick inquired why start-up times for positions requested in both the Northern and Southern Nevada Child and Adolescent Services facilities are different. Ms. Peterson answered that the positions coming on-line in July, 1995, for the Southern Nevada Child and Adolescence Services program are Professional Teaching Parent relief positions. She indicated relief staff are easy to recruit, making it possible for the requested positions to begin earlier in the southern Nevada facility. In contrast, Ms. Peterson declared, the northern Nevada facility needs Professional Teaching Parents in addition to Professional Teaching Parent relief positions, requiring more aggressive recruitment and a longer period of time to fill the positions. Mr. Allard requested an explanation for the large difference between what the agency requested and what the governor recommends for the Maintenance of Buildings and Grounds category in the Base Budget. Ms. Blackwell stated, "A number of contracts were moved into operating that were related to that Maintenance of Buildings and Grounds." Mr. Allard questioned from where were the contracts moved. Ms. Blackwell indicated the contracts were located in the Operating Expenses category prior to being transferred to the Maintenance of Buildings and Grounds category. Ms. Tiffany asked when construction will begin of the juvenile treatment facility. Mr. Sarb surmised the juvenile treatment facility will be completed approximately 2 years from date of approval. Mr. Sarb informed the committee that designs of the facility had been initiated but the project has been suspended until it receives final approval. Mrs. Evans requested an explanation for the high turnover rate in the Professional Teaching Parents. Ms. Peterson indicated the typical length of employment for Professional Teaching Parents is about 2 years. She continued by stating most of the turnover the division has recently experienced, is due to a Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) lawsuit filed by the Professional Teaching Parents and Professional Teaching Parent relief positions. Mrs. Evans questioned if the division is having trouble recruiting as a result of the FLSA lawsuit. Ms. Peterson surmised the difficulty the division is having in recruiting is due to the large number of vacancies. Child Care Services - Page 1323 Senator Rawson addressed the changes in various communities regarding regulations for licensing child care facilities and foster homes and asked if there is a standard in setting regulations. Mr. Sarb indicated the State of Nevada sets regulations which local jurisdictions can change, as long as regulations set by local jurisdictions are no less stringent than the state regulations. Youth Corrections Services - Page 1327 Mr. Sarb denoted the most significant change in the budget is a request for an increase in staffing to enable the division to keep up with caseload growth. Senator Rawson asked for an explanation of the requested positions. Robert A. Cavakis, Director, Youth Correctional Services, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources, stated two additional positions have been requested based upon projected caseload growth and standards. Mr. Cavakis informed the committee the division is also requesting the two three-quarter time administrative aide positions be increased to full-time to maintain a balance in the division due to increased paperwork and caseload. Senator Rawson asked if the two positions the division will be requesting from the Interim Finance Committee (IFC) are different than those requested in the budget. Mr. Cavakis answered in the affirmative and explained the two positions the division will be requesting from IFC are a result of a $100,000 federal grant for an examination of the results of intensive after-care programs on recidivism rates and the success of youths who receive intensive after-care services. He continued, stating the project includes an introductory component at the Caliente Youth Center in which youth identified as parole-ready will be transferred to an entry cottage and set up with community- based services prior to being paroled. Senator Rawson questioned, "Are we able to...do any community linkage from Caliente? Most of those youths are..from other places, at least 150 miles away. Do we need to get them closer to home for that phase of it?" Mr. Cavakis answered in the affirmative; however, he assured, "We will make it work. One of the staff would actually be assigned at Caliente and part of the project would be driving back and forth to Las Vegas. It will be a Clark County-based project." Mr. Hettrick articulated his wish to set the county payments expense in a separate line item. He pronounced another concern he has is with the agency's cellular phones, and asked how the division is planning to utilize the phones and pay for air time. Mr. Cavakis answered the division will use the phones for emergency purposes and will pay $20 per month for the basic minimum service, plus air time. Mr. Cavakis indicated the division has budgeted 100 minutes per phone at $.17 per minute, for a total monthly charge, per phone, of $37. Mr. Dini asked how proposed crime bills will affect the budget. Mr. Sarb stated the division is not sure what effect the crime bills will have on the division. Mrs. Evans inquired about the progress the division is making on collecting Court Ordered Support Payments. Mr. Cavakis declared the division has not increased the amount collected. He indicated the division has hired an individual to begin a regular billing process to collect court ordered payments; however, in order for collections to increase, an individual will have to be hired to actively collect from parents, including court action if necessary. Mr. Cavakis suggested the use of collection agencies to collect the past due payments. Mrs. Evans requested the division to submit, within 2 weeks, a strategy as to how it will increase the collection of court ordered payments. Ms. Tiffany added that she would like included in the strategy report, an accounting of the payments outstanding and what is actually collectable. Probation Subsidies - Page 1335 Senator Raggio requested a breakdown of the distribution of the funds in the budget. Mr. Cavakis indicated the division will promptly provide the requested information. Nevada Youth Training Center - Page 1337 Mr. Sarb reminded the committee the Nevada Youth Training Center budget contains the budget request for a juvenile boot camp which the Governor has requested be withdrawn for consideration of potential federal funding. Senator Raggio clarified with the withdrawal of consideration of the boot camp in decision unit Enhancement 426 Safety of Citizens and Visitors (E-426), that adjustments must be made to the budget, since E-426 contained funding from the General Fund. Senator Raggio questioned if the division has made the necessary adjustments. Mr. Sarb informed the committee adjustments have not yet been made, as the department was just informed to withdraw that decision unit. Senator Rhoads asked if the Nevada Youth Training Center is currently running over capacity. Mr. Cavakis affirmed the center continues to run between 8 and 10 percent over capacity. Senator Rhoads questioned the possibility of federal sanctions if the center continues to operate over capacity. Mr. Cavakis maintained the threat of a lawsuit and ensuing consent decree is continually at issue. Senator Rhoads inquired as to the repercussions, should federal sanctions be implemented. Mr. Cavakis responded, "Well, absent significant capital expenditures for new beds, it would mean youths would back up in local detention facilities, awaiting bed openings in state correctional programs." Mr. Sarb interjected that most federal sanctions are enacted when facilities are overcrowded by half. Senator Rawson referenced the Youth Alternative Placement budget, page 1331, and asked, "This ties into Elko in that had we identified 15 kids we were going to send to Tennessee, and I think M-200 [Maintenance 200 Demographics Caseload Changes], $313,000 in each year, is that affected now, or do we need to talk about that a little bit?" Mr. Sarb responded that current legislation may affect the decision unit Senator Rawson referred to. Senator Rawson inquired as to the status of the legislation referred to by Mr. Sarb. Mr. Sarb indicated the Assembly Committee on Judiciary and the Senate Committee on Judiciary have yet to hold hearings on the juvenile legislation issues. Senator Rawson requested the Fiscal Analysis Division to communicate with the chairmen of both judiciary committees to advise them that budget decisions cannot be made until juvenile legislation issues are discussed. Mr. Hettrick asked what approach the division will use for a boot camp in Elko. Mr. Sarb responded, "Part of the problem we run into is what do you mean by a boot camp?" He reflected that most established boot camps throughout the county are similar to the Nevada Youth Training Center (NYTC) program. The boot camp in Elko will institute a 90-day program rather than the standard 180-day program. Mr. Hettrick vocalized his concern over the experimental 90 day program and stated: If...we turn out these kids in 90 days and...put them right back through the system at the cost of going back through the court systems...to bring them back, on the idea that maybe this is going to work...it bothers me...We are really not going to save any money and what we are looking at is a chunk of money to try it, which then could increase the court system cost and the load in the courts to redo them. I am wondering if this is the right place to experiment....I have some real concerns whether or not this cost justifies...that we should experiment in this place. Mr. Sarb explained the Elko facility was chosen for the experimental 90-day program because it will cost less to conduct the program at that site. Any other site will require capital costs which are not budgeted, he reflected. Mr. Hettrick observed that potential federal funding of a boot camp in Elko, unless that funding is for capital costs, will not be of use in establishing a boot camp. Mr. Sarb corroborated Mr. Hettrick's statement and reflected the federal funding will be for capital costs. Senator Raggio questioned what level of offender will be sent to the boot camp once it is opened. Mr. Sarb replied first time, nonviolent offenders. Senator Raggio maintained if a juvenile boot camp is to make a lasting impression on young boys within the program, it will be best to locate the boot camp within the boundaries of a maximum security prison. Mr. Dini suggested the division should experiment with the 90-day program on an existing juvenile facility, such as Rite of Passage (ROP). Mr. Sarb remarked the division is currently discussing admitting juveniles, that have already been through the NYTC program, to ROP. Mr. Allard requested statistics on the success rate of adult boot camps. Mr. Sarb indicated incentives for adult boot camp prisoners are more intense than those given to juvenile offenders. Mr. Allard asked if the same incentives could be offered to juvenile offenders. Mr. Sarb responded, "We are talking about the difference between 90 days and 180. Not quite the same incentive." Mr. Allard reported that he received a call from a constituent whose son was sent to a boot camp. The boot camp, as relayed by the constituent, provided the son with a high self-esteem, and a good work ethic. He stated: This is the type of thing I was [under] the assumption that a boot camp would instill on people. I will reiterate, as long as it was run like a military style boot camp, I could see nothing but good coming from it, showing them discipline and respect for authority. The true indicator is whether or not they come back, not just how fast you process them and get them back on the street.... Mr. Allard asked for an explanation of the oldest juvenile boot camp program in the United States. Mr. Cavakis indicated the first juvenile boot camp program, initiated in Colorado in January, 1991, was closed in January, 1994. Mr. Allard questioned if any statistics are available from that program. Mr. Cavakis indicated a preliminary report from the Department of Justice shows the difference in the recidivism rate is small. Mr. Cavakis pointed out that juvenile boot camps are still a new concept and it will be several years before a longevity study can be conducted. He informed the committee that adult military style boot camps are more successful due to extensive follow up. Senator Rhoads asked if the NYTC can utilize the Department of Prison's honor camps to relieve the overcrowding. Mr. Sarb responded the NYTC had previously approached the Department of Prisons requesting to use unoccupied honor camps, but was informed that all honor camps will be filled at a later date. Mrs. Chowning commented the figures given by Mr. Cavakis conflict with those provided in an interim crime study. She declared the importance of knowing recidivism rates before the committee can make decisions on such projects. Mr. Cavakis indicated he is not aware of the figures Mrs. Chowning is referring to and stated: I do not know if they are comparing similar populations. The adult boot camp, as I understand it, is for less sophisticated, less serious offenders. Are they measuring those against all criminals for example?...The only studies I have seen are those out of the Department of Justice which consistently reflect a recidivism rate comparable to traditional corrections...The American Correctional Association is currently considering a nationwide proposal to throw recidivism out as a measure of...effectiveness...partly because everybody does it differently. Mr. Cavakis articulated the NYTC program had an 88 percent success rate during the last year. He implied the difficulty in measuring recidivism rates for juveniles is because they leave the juvenile justice system once they are 18 years of age. Mrs. Evans questioned if a bill draft request is necessary for approval of a boot camp. Mr. Sarb answered in the negative. Mrs. Evans stated the importance of receiving a full plan and complete timetable for the boot camp project prior to the end of the legislative session. She indicated if the division waits to approach the Interim Finance Committee (IFC) for approval of the project, she will vote against it because it is an issue the entire Legislature should decide. Turning her attention to FY 1994 expenditures, Ms. Evans asked if the division has taken appropriate steps to insure it will not underspend other expenditure categories in order to provide additional Title XIX (Medicaid) funding than was originally budgeted. Annette Swainston, Administrative Services Officer III, Division of Child and Family Services, Department of Human Resources, declared the division is currently seeking permission from the Medicaid office to bill for the over expenditures made in that category during FY 1994. Ms. Swainston stated the division now bills on an ongoing basis to ensure the same situation does not occur during FY 1995. Mr. Allard questioned if China Spring Youth Camp can be considered a boot camp. Mr. Cavakis answered in the negative and stated the NYTC is similar to a boot camp, though the juvenile offenders do not wear uniforms. Mr. Sarb interjected the fire crew from NYTC is more strenuous than any other boot camp activity in the country. Farm Account - Youth Training Center - Page 1341 Chapter I and II Education Programs - Page 1343 Senator Rawson ascertained there are no comments or questions from the audience or the committee members on the above budget accounts. Caliente Youth Center - Page 1347 Senator Rawson noted the budget does not contain a request for additional positions, but asked if the facility is in need of additional staffing. Mr. Sarb answered in the affirmative. Mrs. Chowning requested statistics on the success of the facility. Mr. Cavakis indicated he will provide the committee with the requested information and informed the committee the Caliente Youth Center tends to have a higher recidivism rate since the youths are younger and are in the juvenile system for a longer period of time. Mr. Allard asked if the program has an agreement with armed forces recruiters. Mr. Sarb responded some residents of the facility are recruited, however the armed forces are in a position to be selective in their recruitments. Chapter I - Special Education Project - Page 1353 Mrs. Evans inquired as to the status of the Office Juvenile Justice Delinquency Prevention Act (OJJDP) grants. Mr. Sarb indicated OJJDP cited discrepancies in the program and put a stipulation on the anticipated grant the program must correct the discrepancies before the grant will be awarded. Mrs. Evans referenced Assembly Bill (A.B.) 689 of the Sixty-seventh Session which requires the Division of Child and Family Services to submit a plan by January 31, 1995 on a statewide system for reporting, collecting and maintaining information regarding juvenile justice in the State of Nevada. ASSEMBLY BILL 689 OF THE SIXTY-SEVENTH SESSION: Makes various changes regarding placement of delinquent children and children in need of supervision. Mrs. Evans stated, "It was not submitted by your division on time. I understand last week it finally did come in; however, it was deemed not acceptable and there are some revisions taking place now. Can you tell us when you will be in compliance with that law?" Mr. Sarb stated that while he was prepared to submit the plan on January 31, 1995, he chose to delay it in order to include additional information. He advised the committee he has not been made aware the plan is not in compliance. Charlotte Crawford, Acting Director, Department of Human Resources clarified that she and Ann Andreini, Executive Assistant for the Governor, reviewed the plan as submitted and deemed it unacceptable within what was asked for by statute. She advised the committee a revised plan will be submitted by the end of this week. Southern Nevada Children's Home - Page 1359 Senator Rawson asked if Volunteers of America are leasing the Southern Nevada Children's Home and running the program. Mr. Sarb answered in the affirmative. Senator Rawson questioned if the program has been successful. Mr. Sarb indicated the program is working well; however, he stated the facilities are in need of one-shot capital improvements. Senator Rawson inquired from where are the funds for the program budgeted. Mr. Sarb answered funds are paid from the Youth Community Services budget. Sheila Leslie, Lobbyist, Action for Nevada's Children, distributed a packet of information (Exhibit E) to the committee and reviewed the contents. She stated: We have highlighted five areas in this budget that we think are priorities for your consideration...Support for Nevada's Foster Families...increasing monthly foster care payments, annual clothing allowances, subsidies for respite and child care for working foster parents and helping foster families acquiring liability coverage...adding social workers to bring...caseloads down...safety for our foster children...and a comprehensive mental health system for children and families... Ms. Leslie indicated that unless funding for prevention programs such as Project Crisis is continued, out-of-state placements will continue to rise with the number of delinquent juveniles. Senator Rawson asked what the expenditures will be to improve those areas of concern expressed by Ms. Leslie. Ms. Leslie indicated most of the expenditures are already included in the budget except funding for Project Crisis, which will require approximately $200,000 to fund. Wendie Catron, Committee Health Nurse, Washoe County District Health Department, provided testimony in support of Project Crisis from prepared text (Exhibit F). May S. Shelton, Lobbyist, Washoe County, furnished testimony in support of Substitute Foster Care, reading from her prepared testimony (Exhibit G). Deann Blazzard, Lobbyist, Foster Parents of Southern Nevada, distributed the Nevada Training Partnership for Youth and Family Services: Foster Parent Training Proposal handout (Exhibit H), and voiced her concern over the proposed increase for monthly foster parent reimbursement. She said, "...5 and 3 percent increase is...equivalent to an insult when you are only paying us 51 percent of what it costs to take care of these children." Senator Rawson asked if Ms. Blazzard is requesting an increase above and beyond what the governor recommends in the Executive Budget. Ms. Blazzard answered in the affirmative. Senator Rawson questioned if Ms. Blazzard uses a standard rate to determine foster parent reimbursement. Ms. Blazzard indicated the Foster Parents of Southern Nevada organization is requesting an increase based upon United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) guidelines. She stated, "We feel the least amount that we could even look at is what our cost of living has increased since our last increase, just to maintain where we were before. It is becoming increasingly difficult just to provide the basic needs for these children." Another concern, according to Ms. Blazzard, is liability coverage. Inasmuch as foster parents with home owners insurance will be able to add a rider to their policy, foster parents who rent will not, she stated. Ms. Blazzard identified the need for an increase in respite care. She emphasized: Currently I am licensed for 5 children, I would receive 1 day for 1 child. I don't know what I would do with the other 4 children...Currently, I have 4 openings in my home because I cannot continue. Howard Thomas, President, Nevada Volunteers of Nevada, relayed his concerns regarding the dilapidated condition of the Southern Nevada Children's Home. Senator Rawson asked who holds the title to the facility. Mr. Thomas indicated the State of Nevada owns the building. Senator Rawson advised Mr. Thomas to provide the committee with a list of requested repairs and improvements. Nancy Peterson, School of Social Work, University of Nevada, Reno, testified in support of increased funding for a foster parent training program. She indicated: A lot has been mentioned about the needs to support and expand our foster parents and I have been working with the Division of Child and Family Services (DCFS) to help develop a foster parent training program that will be in line with the rest of the child welfare training so that we will all be working together much more positively and providing...much better service for the children. I think money is definitely a big issue for the foster parents, but also the quality of the training that they have received in the past has been pretty limited and we want to do some major expansion and improvement on that training.... Senator Rawson turned the gavel over to Chairman Hettrick at 10:40 a.m. Mrs. Evans asked what the requirements are to qualify as a foster parent. Mr. Sarb stated he will provide a list of requirements to the committee. Mrs. Chowning questioned: ...We were told about the difficulty with the foster parents in never getting any time off and yet they can not even take...the foster children... to their sister's home, for instance. I am wondering why we cannot work through that...we have to be realistic and look at this. If that sister's home is good enough for their own children to go, then why is it not good for the foster child? Mr. Sarb stated the division is currently working on that problem. Mrs. Chowning requested a copy of the policy regarding respite care for foster children. Mr. Hettrick adjourned the meeting at 10:50 a.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: Cristin Buchanan, Committee Secretary APPROVED BY: Senator Raymond D. Rawson, Chairman DATE: Assemblywoman Jan Evans, Chairman DATE: Assemblyman Lynn Hettrick, Chairman DATE: Senate Committee on Finance Assembly Committee on Ways and Means Joint Subcommittee on Human Resources/K-12 March 7, 1995