MINUTES OF THE SENATE COMMITTEE ON COMMERCE AND LABOR Sixty-eighth Session June 22, 1995 The Senate Committee on Commerce and Labor was called to order by Chairman Randolph J. Townsend, at 7:30 a.m., on Thursday, June 22, 1995, in Room 227 of the Legislative Building, Carson City, Nevada. Exhibit A is the Agenda. Exhibit B is the Attendance Roster. COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Senator Randolph J. Townsend, Chairman Senator Ann O'Connell, Vice Chairman Senator Sue Lowden Senator Kathy M. Augustine Senator Raymond C. Shaffer Senator John B. (Jack) Regan Senator Joseph M. Neal, Jr. GUEST LEGISLATORS PRESENT: Assemblywoman Christina R. Giunchilgliani, Clark County Assembly District No.9 STAFF MEMBERS PRESENT: Scott Young, Senior Research Analyst Molly Dondero, Committee Secretary OTHERS PRESENT: I.R. Ashleman, Lobbyist, Southern Nevada Home Builders Association Margi Grien, Lobbyist, State Contractors' Board John Burgess, D.P.M., Member, State Board of Podiatry Ronda Clifton, Deputy Attorney General, Office of the Attorney General Tom Skancke, Lobbyist, Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority Ande Engleman, Lobbyist, Freedom of Information Foundation John Madole, Lobbyist, Associated General Contractors, Nevada Chapter Steve Kalb, President, Associated General Contractors-Las Vegas Chapter Brian Herr, Director, External Affairs, Nevada Bell Linda Stetter, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Associated Builders and Contractors- Sierra Nevada Chapter Marv Byars, Associated General Contractors, President, H.M. Byars Construction Fred Taeubel, President, TNT Construction Inc. Chris Silsby, Project Engineer Max Christiansen, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Sheet Metal-Air Conditioning Contractors Association-Southern Nevada Richard W. Lisle, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Mechanical Contractors Association, Inc. Renee Diamond, Administrator, Manufactured Housing Division Gary Rutherford, Concerned Citizen Charles Knaus, Actuary, Insurance Division Greg Harwell, Lobbyist, California State Automobile Association, American Automobile Association (AAA) Bill Bradley, Lobbyist, Nevada Trial Lawyers Association (NTLA) Stephanie Tyler, Lobbyist, Nevada State Board of Chiropractic Examiners Sharen Weaver, Supervisor, Life and Health, Insurance Division Robert F. Martin, Lobbyist, Nevada Association of Homeopathic Physicians David Horton, Lobbyist, Alternative Therapy Support Group Assemblywoman Christina R. Giunchilgliani, Clark County Assembly District No.9, presented Assembly Bill (A.B.) 399. Assembly Bill 399: Revises provisions relating to state contractors' board. She explained the bill was introduced to protect consumers against unlicensed contractors. She stated the bill will give the board enabling powers to punish unlicensed contractors. She pointed out the Assembly voted unanimously for this bill. Senator Regan questioned if the damages listed in section 6, subsection 3 (c) would be paid to the consumer. Ms. Giunchilgliani stated the intent is for the money to go to the consumer for damages caused by the unlicensed contractor. I.R. Ashleman, Lobbyist, Southern Nevada Home Builders Association, stated Senate Bill (S.B.) 71 and S.B. 395 address correcting deficiencies and fixing problems caused by contractors. He stated they do have full authority in that area. SENATE BILL 71: Revises provisions relating to disciplinary actions taken by state contractors' board. SENATE BILL 395: Regulates recovery for defects in residential construction. Senator Neal pointed out the particular provision is in addition to the remedies which are found in section 2. He asked if Senator Regan wishes to go beyond the application of this penalty. Senator Regan stated he does. He said if an unlicensed contractor has caused damage to an individual's home, he should be responsible to fix the damage. Ms. Giunchilgliani explained that is the intent of the language. Senator Regan pointed out that many fines go into the Office of the Attorney General's budget or into the General Fund and he wants to be certain it goes to the consumer. Mr. Ashelman pointed out this is not a requirement for a fine. It is a requirement to pay court costs and administrative costs and it may be directed to the consumer. Margi Grien, Lobbyist, State Contractors' Board, concurred with the amended version of A.B. 399. The hearing was closed on A.B. 399 and opened on A.B. 690. ASSEMBLY BILL 690: Revises provisions governing practice of podiatry. John Burgess, D.P.M., Member, State Board of Podiatry, presented A.B. 690. He explained the need for fee increases. Dr. Burgess explained that national charges for testing have risen substantially since the statute was written. He explained that reciprocity in podiatry licensure is rare. He stated few states allow reciprocity. Senator O'Connell asked if there have been many complaints from the public against podiatrists. Ronda Clifton, Deputy Attorney General, Office of the Attorney General, commented that most of the complaints are against the same few doctors. She indicated there are fewer complaints to this board than to others. Senator O'Connell asked how the discipline problems are handled. Ms. Clifton explained that a board member evaluates the medical charts and tells Ms. Clifton if anything was done improperly. An expert will then determine if there is malpractice. Then the board member, who did the original review, will abstain from making a decision on the case as a board member. Then a hearing is conducted. Ms. Clifton commented there is less than one hearing per year. The hearing was closed on A.B. 690 and opened on A.B. 582. ASSEMBLY BILL 582: Revises provisions governing right of publicity. Tom Skancke, Lobbyist, Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority, discussed the bill. He explained the reason for the bill. It is to give the Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority permission to use photographs, currently, in the archives. He explained the photographs were inherited from the old Las Vegas News Bureau by the Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority. He stated there are thousands of old photographs denoting events in Las Vegas and Clark County. He explained many of the photographs contain pictures of celebrities who relate to Las Vegas. He pointed out that many of the photographs of these notable people also contain other people in the background of the pictures. He stated the photographs will be used for publicity, only, to promote tourism in Las Vegas. He explained they may not be used without obtaining a waiver from each person in the picture. He stated the bill will allow the use of photographs which contain "an identifiable face" which is a picture of anyone who is not in the public domain. Senator Neal asked if the Las Vegas News Bureau was a contracting agency of the Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority. Mr. Skancke stated he does not think it was. Senator O'Connell questioned the language on lines 8, 9, and 10. She pointed out it sounds as if there is intent to use more than just historical pictures. Mr. Skancke stated there are events which are photographed for use in the future for promotional reasons. He explained the Las Vegas Marathon and the National Finals Rodeo are a few. He explained if a cowboy is riding a bronco, and there are identifiable faces in the background the bill will allow the convention authority to use the picture without having to find each of the people in the background and obtain a waiver. Ande Engleman, Lobbyist, Freedom of Information Foundation, pointed out that a person has the right to control the use of their image and their name. She pointed out that the bill will allow government agencies to take pictures and not obtain a release from people in the picture. She suggested it may cause embarrassment to someone to have the photograph taken and used for publicity. She stated it is not a problem to allow the Las Vegas Convention/Visitors Authority to use historical photographs, but there is a problem with the bill because there is no limitation in the bill to prevent them from trespassing onto private property without a release. She stated the press is not allowed to do this. She stated the bill is not limited to just Washoe and Clark counties. It will apply to every county in the state. She stated people in some of the rural areas may not know the laws regarding the right of privacy. Senator Augustine asked if the bill may be limited to convention authorities. Ms. Engleman did not know if that will help. She requested the bill limit the access to private property so that permission must be obtained. Mr. Skancke stated there are many tourism authorities in the state including the Commission on Tourism. Senator Lowden commented the press takes pictures at sporting events and they do not obtain releases from each person in a crowd. Ms. Engleman stated that the press must have a release to go onto private property and she requested that the same limitation be extended to government. Senator Regan suggested the key words may be on line 11 of the bill. He stated there must be a good reason for taking the picture. Ms. Engleman stated the language on line 10 is very broad. It allows taking pictures to "promote travel and tourism." She pointed out that if people are voting in historic locations, this bill will allow pictures to be taken during voting which is not allowed. Mr. Skancke pointed out the definition of "government agency" is one which relates directly to those which promote tourism, travel and historical events. He stated police officers and other government officials will not be allowed to take photographs. This bill is only for promotion of tourism and travel. He stated it is "not our intention to go out a start snapping pictures." He stated the main purpose of the bill is to allow them to use photographs which are 20 and 30 years old which depict important events in the community. Senator Lowden commented there is a way to notify people attending a function that pictures may be taken which will be used for publicity. She suggested the information be on the ticket, or in an announcement. Mr. Skancke stated they do that at Madison Square Garden and at the Forum in Las Angeles. Ms. Engleman stated that will be fine with her and her main concern is not with the convention authority, it is with other, smaller, less sophisticated agencies. She pointed out the bill applies to everyone in the state. Senator Regan stated line 7 may be amended to read "only statutory purpose." Ms. Engleman commented Fair and Recreation Boards would still be included and their members may not be only involved with tourism promotion. Senator Townsend directed Ms. Engleman and Mr. Skancke to work out the language and to come to an agreement. The hearing was closed on A.B. 582 and opened with a discussion of a bill draft (BDR) request. BILL DRAFT REQUEST 54-2042: Provides for education of contractors. John Madole, Lobbyist, Associated General Contractors, Nevada Chapter, presented Exhibit C. He stated the bill will establish an education fund for contractors in the state to teach them construction management. He stated it adds a $30 fee to be added to the renewal fees for contractors' licenses. He corrected the language in section 6 which should have been listed in section 7. He presented Exhibit D. He stated the education will be focused on management issues of construction contractors. He suggested there is not enough availability for courses in cost accounting, depreciation, and management. Senator O'Connell asked if everyone affected by the bill has agreed to the fee increase. Mr. Madole said not everyone supports the bill. He stated his association supports the bill, but not all of the construction organizations in the state are in favor of the bill. He stated meetings have been going on for many months to try to draft agreeable language. He stated an advisory committee, which is not the same as a board, is created by the bill. Senator O'Connell asked how much authority the advisory committee will have to determine how the funds being collected for education will be spent. Mr. Madole stated the committee will have little or no authority. Senator Neal asked why this bill is needed. Mr. Madole stated education is an area which needs more funding and this bill seems the best way to accomplish the goals. Senator Neal asked why the education cannot be accomplished through seminars. Mr. Madole state the fees will not generate enough funds to accomplish all the education which is needed and he feels there will still be seminars used. Ms. Grien commented the fines which are collected from non licensed contractors goes into the court system. The fines imposed by the State Contractors' Board are administrative penalties and those fines go to the General Fund. Senator Shaffer stated he attended a general contractors' meeting and there was general disagreement with the provisions of this bill. He referred to page 5, subsection 2 of Exhibit C. Mr. Madole stated the language is existing language already in statute and the bill drafter adapted that language to this bill. Senator Shaffer asked how many members of the Associated General Contractors (AGC) are in favor of the bill. Mr. Madole commented there are 280 members. Senator Shaffer asked if it is proper for 280 people to dictate what over 12,000 other people should be doing. Mr. Madole stated no, but there is support of the bill within the AGC. Senator Shaffer commented many of the trades have their own educational programs to educate their members and they handle the finances within their organizations to fund those programs. He questioned whether the average contractor will be interested in participating in courses at the university system level. Senator Shaffer expressed his objection to the bill draft request. Steve Kalb, President, Associated General Contractors-Las Vegas Chapter, expressed, though there is general support of the concept of the BDR, his board will not take a position on the bill draft request. He stated the board conducted several meetings in Clark County, but were unable to obtain broad support of the BDR from other organizations. Senator O'Connell asked if the AGC in Las Vegas has a training program for contractors. Mr. Kalb stated the Las Vegas chapter has continuing education programs which are sponsored through the AGC. Mr. Madole stated there is a program at the University of Nevada, Reno and he thinks some of this funding can be used for the program. Senator Regan commented a scholarship fund might be a better use for the money. That way interested contractors may take advantage of the program. He commented the state does not need another six-member board appointed by the Governor with an executive director paying $80 per day in per diem which is allowed in this BDR. Mr. Madole stated the members of the board serve without compensation. He stated the word "committee" is a more appropriate term, rather than "board." Brian Herr, Director, External Affairs, Nevada Bell, explained their support of the bill. He stated that under the old system, Nevada Bell was exempt from going through the licensing process. He stated that exemption in no longer recognized. He explained Nevada Bell has spent far more than the $30 asked for to educate someone within their organization. He stated the educational fund will be of benefit to Nevada Bell and other telephone companies who must now have licensed contractors on staff. Senator O'Connell discussed page 3 and page 4. She commented that section 7 says there will be expenses to support the board requested. Mr. Madole stated the bill drafter took existing language which pertains to the existing State Contractors' Board and applied it to the BDR. He stated it has nothing to do with the advisory committee the BDR requests. He stated he realizes the use of the word "board" is confusing. Senator O'Connell asked why the AGC would want to put so much money into someone else's hands and not have any control over that money. Linda Stetter, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Associated Builders abd Contractors-Sierra Nevada Chapter, stated they do not want any one trade association to dominate the committee and feel it is better to place the money into the university system. Senator O'Connell suggested the funds be "dedicated funds" so they may not be used for any other program. Ms. Stetter explained it is her understanding that is what the bill will do. She stated that is the intent of the bill. Mr. Madole referred to section 9 of Exhibit C. He stated the money is supposed to be for construction education exclusively. Marv Byars, Associated General Contractors, President, H.M. Byars Construction, stressed the AGC in northern Nevada has put a great deal of money into education. He stated he does not feel conducting these classes in the university system will intimidate contractors. He feels they will attend the classes. He stated it will be an advantage to the state if more contractors understand management of their businesses, learn to estimate, and expand their knowledge on legal and accounting issues. Fred Taeubel, President, TNT Construction Inc., expressed his support of education which will help contractors to become better businessmen. He stated he is willing to pay the extra fee to launch a program of education for contractors. Chris Silsby, Project Engineer, expressed his support of the BDR. Senator O'Connell asked if it is possible to work directly with the community colleges to establish a course in management. That way anyone who is interested in the course may pay for it instead of charging everyone for a course which they may or may not wish to take. Ms. Stetter commented the BDR is to establish statewide opportunities for education in construction management. She stated all community colleges may not choose to participate in the program. Senator O'Connell objected to the idea of forcing everyone to pay for this program. Senator Regan stated that if anyone gives $300,000 to any of the university system schools they will have no problem implementing a program. Ms. Stetter pointed out that is why they are asking for this bill, so that they may create a mechanism to generate the $300,000. Mr. Byars stressed the emphasis of this bill is to develop the program which has been created over the years. He stated he would like to see a construction management degree offered within the university system. He stressed there is a need for the education requested. Senator Regan stressed the need for a scholarship fund. Senator Shaffer expressed his concern for the request in the BDR which is to ask 12,000 people to fund classes which will educate people to compete against them. He stressed a contractor who wishes the education should be able to pay for it on his own. He stated he does not feel it is right to ask each contractor in the state to fund someone else's education. Ms. Stetter read Exhibit E. Senator O'Connell asked why management courses are not a part of the license. Ms. Stetter explained there is still the issue of access to the programs. To make it a requirement, but to not offer the educational opportunity, is not fair to contractors in Nevada. She stated it will exclude rural contractors and eliminate equal opportunity. She emphasized education should be available to everyone. Max Christiansen, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Sheet Metal-Air Conditioning Contractors Association-Southern Nevada, stated he is speaking today on behalf of the Electrical Contractors Association, the Plumbing and Mechanical Contractors Association, and the Nevada Contractors Association. He stated less than 2 percent of the industry is in support of this legislation. He spoke against the BDR. Richard W. Lisle, Lobbyist, Executive Director, Mechanical Contractors Association, Inc., stated it is not the job of government to educate contractors, to create entrepreneurs, or to instill business acumen. He stated the job of government is to regulate contractors. He stated mandatory user fees, collected by government, to be placed in an earmarked fund, to spend on education is not necessary. He stressed the existing community college system is there for anyone who wishes to use it. He expressed his support for a voluntary scholarship arrangement where there is a box on a renewal form to contribute to the fund. With no further testimony, the hearing on BDR 54-2042 was closed and a work session was opened on A.B. 582. Mr. Skancke discussed the resolution he and Ms. Engleman have reached on the bill previously discussed. He stated line 7, will have the language inserted to read, "and has a population of 100,000 or more and includes a commission on tourism." He suggested page 2, line 15 will include the language, "where feasible, an announcement and/or disclosure would be provided to inform the public that their likeness may be used in connection with the promotion of tourism or travel." SENATOR O'CONNELL MOVED TO AMEND AND DO PASS A.B. 582. SENATOR NEAL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR TOWNSEND ABSTAINED FROM THE VOTE.) ***** Senator Townsend explained he must abstain from the vote because his firm represents a convention authority in a county larger than 100,000. The hearing was closed on A.B. 582 and opened on S.B. 252. SENATE BILL 252: Authorizes manufactured housing division of department of business and industry to establish trust account for advance fees and provides requirements for licensing of certain applicants as manufacturer, dealer, rebuilder, serviceman, or installer. Renee Diamond, Administrator, Manufactured Housing Division, explained the proposed amendment. She stated the amendment proposed by the division's attorney general will permit the Manufactured Housing Division to have one principal officer or a responsible managing employee who will be the responsible licensee. Senator Regan asked how this will affect the education required of the installer of mobile homes as a condition of licensing. Ms. Diamond stated financial responsibility is required. She explained they will have to take the initial exam and the testing material is not affected by continuing education. She stated all financial requirements are still in place. She commented only the education portion will be repealed. Senator Regan stated the moving and installing of mobile homes is very critical to the continued quality of the home. He stated if a corporate president is being licensed and the installers are not qualified, who is responsible. Ms. Diamond emphasized all the licensing requirements are still in effect. She stated the amendment only effects corporations where there are multiple partners in multiple states. SENATOR O'CONNELL MOVED TO CONCUR WITH AMENDMENT NO. 884 TO S.B. 252. SENATOR NEAL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. ***** The work session was closed on S.B. 252 and opened on A.B. 192. ASSEMBLY BILL 192: Makes various changes to provisions relating to hearing aid specialists. The Assembly has requested an amendment change to the bill to replace the fees which were removed through amendment. SENATOR AUGUSTINE MOVED TO NOT RECEDE FROM ACTION ON A.B. 192. SENATOR SHAFFER SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. ***** The work session was closed on A.B. 192 and opened on S.B. 555. There was a discussion on S.B. 555 and amendment No. 1157. SENATE BILL 555: Requires independent medical examinations under certain circumstances for insureds and claimants under policies of motor vehicle insurance. Senator Townsend asked why the amendment removes the provisions in section 2 of Exhibit F requiring a person to be 55 years old to qualify. Gary Rutherford, Concerned Citizen, stated the reason for the repeal of this requirement is that he feels it segregates an age group and the provisions in the bill should be available to all age groups. Charles Knaus, Actuary, Insurance Division, stated changing the regulation will not be an advantage to the good driver. He stated he is favor with the "tone" of the bill. He said it does not help those drivers who are in the "high risk" categories, but will allow the good driver to control their costs. Exhibit G was submitted for the record. Greg Harwell, Lobbyist, California State Automobile Association, American Automobile Association (AAA), expressed his concern with extending the discount to all drivers. He stated the mature drivers who receive the discount because they have taken the course, have a frequency rate of accidents twice that of other drivers in Nevada. He stated AAA's actuarial rates show that only 2 percent of the mature drivers will benefit from the legislation. He stated the course suggested in the bill does not affect driving behavior or habits of individuals. He stated extending the courses to younger drivers has not been tested actuarially and he indicated he does not know if the courses will help drivers to improve their driving habits. Bill Bradley, Lobbyist, Nevada Trial Lawyers Association (NTLA), discussed Exhibit F, page 3, section 1, subsection 4, and indicated he does not think it is necessary for the physician who accompanies the claimant to be in the same specialty as the physician conducting the independent medical exam (IME). He stated it is impractical to expect a specialist to leave his practice for a portion of his day to accompany the claimant. He requested the removal of the last sentence in subsection 4. Stephanie Tyler, Lobbyist, Nevada State Board of Chiropractic Examiners, explained the reasons for adding that language to the amendment. She commented the doctor conducting the IME should be in the same field as the doctor who is treating the patient. She pointed out this should be a peer review of the patient. Mr. Harwell stated it is appropriate to remove the language discussed. Senator Townsend clarified the discussion. He stated there is disagreement on the removal of 55 years from section 2, paragraph (a), and agreement with the removal of section 1, subsection 4, the last sentence. SENATOR REGAN MOVED TO AMEND AND DO PASS BY REMOVING THE BRACKETS ON PAGE 4, PARAGRAPH (a) AND TO DELETE SECTION 1, SUBSECTION 4, THE SECOND SENTENCE OF AMENDMENT NO. 1157 OF S.B. 555. SENATOR SHAFFER SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR NEAL WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.) ***** Senator Townsend commended the NTLA for being able to work out the language for this bill. Senator Townsend stated the committee will monitor the provisions in the bill to determine if the bill, once implemented, is beneficial to consumers. The hearing was closed on S.B. 555 and opened on S.B. 196. SENATE BILL 196: Prohibits certain insurance coverages from excluding coverage for certain treatment provided by homeopathic physicians. Sharen Weaver, Supervisor, Life and Health, Insurance Division, discussed Exhibit H. She stated she is comfortable with regulating the bill with the new language which has been added by the amendment. Robert F. Martin, Lobbyist, Nevada Association of Homeopathic Physicians, recommended passage of the bill. David Horton, Lobbyist, Alternative Therapy Support Group, agreed with Mr. Martin. SENATOR REGAN MOVED TO AMEND AND DO PASS S.B. 196 WITH AMENDMENT NO. 1199. SENATOR O'CONNELL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR AUGUSTINE VOTED NO. SENATORS LOWDEN AND NEAL WERE ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.) ***** The work session was closed on S.B. 196. There being no further business, the hearing was closed at 9:50 a.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED: Molly Dondero, Committee Secretary APPROVED BY: Senator Randolph J. Townsend, Chairman DATE: Senate Committee on Commerce and Labor June 22, 1995 Page